Debate Space: 9/11 Part I.

See the comments section for a debate over “alternative” theories regarding the events of 9/11.

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11 Responses to “Debate Space: 9/11 Part I.”


  1. 1 Alistair February 3, 2010 at 3:28 pm

    [W]atch some truth docs bbc5.tv thecrowhouse.com and take the words ‘conspiracy’ and ‘theory’ out of your head

  2. 2 Ed February 3, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    And replace them with the words “a” and “lot” and “of” and “silly” and “nonsense”. More seriously though, Alistair, unless you’re having a kind of postmodern joke at our (or simply my) expense, you look to believe in just about every conspiracy theory going, presumably including some fruity stuff about 9/11. If so, then do you fancy a small debate on the latter?

  3. 3 Alistair February 3, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    No not even tempted mate.i’m fed up with people believing in the constant stream of propaganda lies we’re being fed by the bbc and the rest of the mass media.I’m not interested in debating anymore with peoples egos and intellectual muscle.please don’t respond , over and out

  4. 4 Jim February 3, 2010 at 3:34 pm

    In two minutes of browsing that site I’ve heard and read that: Darwinian evolution is false; all cancers can be cured with vitamin B17; climate change is false; that there is a science of miracles….

    God knows what else you might find: Maybe even a belief that all these conspiracy theories are themselves a meta-conspiracy theory orchestrated by the Jews to promulgate their Zionist agenda of World Domination. Maybe it’s turtles all the way down.

  5. 5 Alistair February 3, 2010 at 3:35 pm

    nice one jim two minutes ought to get to the bottom of things . This planet is heading fast towards a one world governance and if you and others who also seem to know best don’t take control of your ego’s and stop throwing your intellect around soon and wake up , Its gonna be a shitty old place to live.

    Only a closed mind is certain,…global warming IS false and i have a documentary i challenge you to watch , if you’re open minded enough that is !

  6. 6 Alistair February 3, 2010 at 3:38 pm

    …A point i’d like to make as clearly as poss for… jim and ed.Is that the only reason i’ve ended up where i have is through entertaining rationally and cross checking as thoroughly as possible as many different arguments as i could.What i hold now is not a conlcuded opinion because that is a dead end , but an ever growing library of information on different issues that correlate logically . I wasn’t born a conspiracy addict and i wish the docs i’ve watched,books i’ve read and people i’ve listened to were wrong and i’m constantly open to new ideas….

    Something i quickly discovered through following this path is that debating with people opposing arguments,quickly brings out the devils advocate in people, a battle of egos.Discussing issues objectively – always – actually just sends all involved around and around in circles and doesn’t actually solve anything…meanwhile the ‘truth’ (and i won’t preach what that is)is steadily plodding fwd.

    This is the reason i’ve stepped back from debating with people for now.It doesn’t mean my mind is closed.I’m just asking that you guys (ed and jim)actually do take an open minded look at what the people i’ve referred you to are saying.And you’ll notice they all say “don’t take my word for it”………They also have no hidden agenda

  7. 7 Ed February 3, 2010 at 3:39 pm

    Jim,

    Talking of the Jew thing, one of the first images I saw on that site was this one: http://tinyurl.com/y9ryvcx Compare and contrast with this well-known piece of anti-Semitic Nazi propaganda: http://tinyurl.com/yh86jp5

  8. 8 Ed February 3, 2010 at 3:40 pm

    Alistair,

    I suppose I was taking the piss. When you express those beliefs in public you will – rightly, I think – pay a price in barely concealed laughter. I usually find, moreover, that those given to repeatedly proclaiming how open their minds are have usually opened them enough to let their brains fall out. Holding that certain theories are irrational, stupid, pernicious and, ultimately, racist – as I do yours – hardly necessitates a “closed mind” – many ideas are, after all, just those things. They are an affront to Enlightenment values and also rather cowardly: I never thought I’d quote George Monbiot, but the “virtue of a fake conspiracy is that it calls on you to do nothing”. Incidentally, should anyone think conspiracism eccentric but harmless, it’s worth noting, to give just one example, that the belief terminal illnesses can be cured with simple vitamins – as promoted by the site you link – has led to hundreds of thousands of deaths, namely when AIDS denialism convinced South African president Thabo Mbeki to privilege vitamin pills over clinically proven retro-viral drugs.

    You say your opinions are logical and informed by disinterested research. That, though, is what every crank says and that you no longer engage with people with opposing views is at diametrically opposed to this self-proclaimed rigour.

    You also seem concerned any debate would be unfocused and ultimately fruitless. In that case I suggest we proceed step by step – that we start by you identifying, as specifically and tersely as possible, what you consider the most (or one of the most) compelling pieces of evidence for an “alternative” theory regarding 9/11 and we then assess it soberly.

    So why don’t we put your research and logic skills to the test? Even if you think I’m credulous, an egotist or an ignoramus, then you have a perfect opportunity both to present your case and to show me up for what I am. If I become unreasonable, belligerent, or whatever you suspect I will, then you would be perfectly justified in leaving, and no one reading would see this as anything other than a principled move. If you are right, therefore, you, unlike me, have nothing to lose and potentially a lot to gain…

  9. 9 Jim February 3, 2010 at 3:41 pm

    Ed, the anti-Semitism is no surprise. I did a little research myself and discovered that the website also promulgates the New World Order and Illuminati memes. Maybe in spite of his thorough academic research Alistair failed to realise that this nonsense was – and still is – related to an anti-Semitic, racist and murderous tradition that has plagued our societies for the past two thousand years. Maybe he also forgot about the concomitant and ignominious genocidal history.

    Though it’s possible this is no crime of omission; perhaps he is himself a racist and an anti-Semite… If I’ve been unfair, a disavowal of this nonsense would be welcome and my
    apology forthcoming….

  10. 10 Alistair February 3, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    wow.you amaze me.i’m up for continuing…i don’t like my chances though.you guys are way to intelligent by the looks of it . . . .1ove

  11. 11 Ed February 3, 2010 at 3:58 pm

    Alistair,

    Thanks a lot for agreeing to debate me! As I suggested earlier, we should perhaps “proceed step by step… by you identifying, as specifically and tersely as possible, what you consider the most (or one of the most) compelling pieces of evidence for an “alternative” theory regarding 9/11 and we then assess it soberly.”

    So, the floor is yours!


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